In reply to @erincandescent:fairydust.space
If the board wishes to just be a legal and fiscal vehicle - i.e. if it's members wish to be pure bureaucrats (and this is a very reasonable position to take; and indeed it's a job that needs going and is much appreciated), then perhaps it would be a good idea for it to explicitly delegate it's powers to a community function wherever possible, reserving just those it needs to explicitly protect itself; as opposed to the current situation where it is responsible for deciding every aspect of policy

In reply to @nat-418:nat-418.xyz
I see Determinate Systems as a VC-funded, for-profit fork of Nix (in the broader sense). It seems to me that by having an alternate installer, alternate documentation, an alternate community, &c. that promotes an alternate experimental technology (flakes), DetSys seeks to establish itself as a commercial alternative Nix ecosystem. My understanding was that your recent blog post invited Nix community members to join the DetSys community. If I am wrong, then I am more than willing to be corrected. I sincerely appreciate your work and willingness to answer questions.

In reply to @nat-418:nat-418.xyz
I see Determinate Systems as a VC-funded, for-profit fork of Nix (in the broader sense). It seems to me that by having an alternate installer, alternate documentation, an alternate community, &c. that promotes an alternate experimental technology (flakes), DetSys seeks to establish itself as a commercial alternative Nix ecosystem. My understanding was that your recent blog post invited Nix community members to join the DetSys community. If I am wrong, then I am more than willing to be corrected. I sincerely appreciate your work and willingness to answer questions.

In reply to @nat-418:nat-418.xyz
I see Determinate Systems as a VC-funded, for-profit fork of Nix (in the broader sense). It seems to me that by having an alternate installer, alternate documentation, an alternate community, &c. that promotes an alternate experimental technology (flakes), DetSys seeks to establish itself as a commercial alternative Nix ecosystem. My understanding was that your recent blog post invited Nix community members to join the DetSys community. If I am wrong, then I am more than willing to be corrected. I sincerely appreciate your work and willingness to answer questions.

In reply to @nat-418:nat-418.xyz
Eelco: is this ^ understanding of Determinate Systems relationship to Nix wrong in your view?

In reply to @niksnut:matrix.org
Yes, that's wrong. With the installer and zero-to-nix, we identified problems in the current ecosystem and sought to improve them. They're open source and can be upstreamed. Flakes pre-date DetSys and are widely used, and we have every right to go all in on them.

In reply to @nat-418:nat-418.xyz
So you improved them by creating alternatives?

In reply to @niksnut:matrix.org
Yes, that's often how open source works. nix.dev started out as a Domen/cachix project. The tvix folks have every right to create a better Nix. Etc.

In reply to @niksnut:matrix.org
The board doesn't decide every aspect of policy, in fact the only real policy we have so far is the sponsorship policy, and that only arose because we're helping with the financial side of NixCon. So there really isn't much power to delegate to the community, because we don't have those powers in the first place.

And yet the board decided to set that policy in its entirety, rather than reserving for itself the powers it needs (e.g. right of veto, for legal protection/etc) and delegating the rest

Right now it feels like the board is simultaneously expressing a desire to not be making policy, but also it is not delegating that policy making capability to other organs of the project

In reply to @niksnut:matrix.org
What influence do you see us seeking? For instance, we're not NixOS release managers, we're not on the RFC SC, the mod team, etc.

In reply to @erincandescent:fairydust.space

And yet the board decided to set that policy in its entirety, rather than reserving for itself the powers it needs (e.g. right of veto, for legal protection/etc) and delegating the rest

Right now it feels like the board is simultaneously expressing a desire to not be making policy, but also it is not delegating that policy making capability to other organs of the project

In reply to @niksnut:matrix.org
Yes, that's often how open source works. nix.dev started out as a Domen/cachix project. The tvix folks have every right to create a better Nix. Etc.

Tvix is not (yet) a for-profit project nor does it advocate for its use other than for purposes of experimentation. DetSys' positioning is obviously very, different, wouldn't you agree?

To act as if your implicit power in the project (as a still very much present creator) has no bearing on how DetSys positioning is perceived is simply either really naïve or disingenuous.

As a relative newcomer, DetSys' output has repeatedly confused me, because as opposed to just advocating for change internally you advocate to users directly. The steering of folks to your Discord is just the most recent example.