| 15 Apr 2024 |
|  @nscnt:matrix.org left the room. | 17:37:28 |
| 16 Apr 2024 |
|  the_null joined the room. | 08:26:12 |
| @nscnt:matrix.org joined the room. | 18:55:33 |
|  jhuc joined the room. | 19:09:36 |
| 18 Apr 2024 |
 ronef | Just posted the financial summary https://discourse.nixos.org/t/nixos-foundation-financial-summary-a-transparent-look-into-2023/43640 | 15:20:17 |
| ronef | Feedback super appreciated as this is only the second year we've been having this as an explicit effort | 15:20:41 |
| ronef | If anyone is interested to help boost on socials as well it can be helpful in making sure folks see it and also the next effort of growing interest for more structured donations in the scope of Sustainable Nix <3
https://www.linkedin.com/posts/ronefroni_nixos-foundation-financial-summary-a-transparent-activity-7186747697242984449-14v-?
https://twitter.com/ronefroni/status/1780982712943473104 | 15:34:12 |
|  @way_nkg:matrix.org joined the room. | 17:44:03 |
|  @reedrichards:matrix.org joined the room. | 21:14:32 |
| @reedrichards:matrix.org | Not sure if this is the right place to post this but I'm starting a NixOS meetup in SF starting next Wednesday, Is there anything I could do to get it posted on https://www.meetup.com/silicon-valley-nix-nixos-user-group/, https://www.linkedin.com/company/nixos-foundation/posts/?feedView=all, or any of the other social pages? | 21:19:39 |
| ronef | I manage the meetup group and can get it posted there! can you ping me @ ron@floxdev.com and we can work on the meetup link together? | 22:37:15 |
| ronef | I'll also share the discourse post with the marketing team, but might be better that they post it after we make the meetup invite? | 22:38:03 |
| ronef | Also, would you prefer to create a matrix room inside of the Nix channel or do you want to keep it a separate matrix channel completely? (might be a bit more discoverable with the former) | 22:39:29 |
| @reedrichards:matrix.org | Yea I'd for sure prefer to keep the matrix room inside of the nix channel! | 22:49:04 |
| @reedrichards:matrix.org | I'll shoot you an email | 22:49:10 |
| 19 Apr 2024 |
 @delroth:delroth.net | question to the board: who from the foundation side is tracking how the Summer of Nix money is being used and whether that's actually a valuable investment for the community? | 16:00:49 |
| @delroth:delroth.net | my semi-external view of Summer of Nix at this point:
- almost nothing gets contributed back to nixpkgs - the result of SoN is too low quality to actually contribute back so instead it gets stored to rot in ngipkgs
- the foundation pays people to admin the program who seem to have very little experience with nix development and are more interested in pushing development techniques that haven't proven to be effective ("mob programming" - all I've heard from prior participants is that it's a waste of time, and it's very much pushing away potential participants, to the point that I think some exceptions have been made this year?)
- you could argue it serves to attract new contributors, but uh, do we have any evidence that this works? I know of one prior participant converting to becoming a contributor, but the program really isn't structured well to do this.
- in the meantime, it's the biggest cost center to the project. Yes, it's all paid for by nlnet in the end, but uh, that's not a good way to use public money on nix?
| 16:07:01 |
| @delroth:delroth.net | and let's not even talk about the SoN money wastage that gets put in the infrastructure bucket - like the completely idle 300€/month machine that's been in our hetzner account for a year completely unused but earmarked "for SoN" | 16:07:41 |
| @delroth:delroth.net | I know ronef we talked about this at FOSDEM this year already so at least this shouldn't be news to you... | 16:08:52 |
| @delroth:delroth.net | * and let's not even talk about the SoN money wastage that gets put in the infrastructure bucket - like the completely idle 300€/month machine that was sitting in our hetzner account for a year completely unused but earmarked "for SoN" | 16:11:34 |
 Pol | Funny... I asked a question about that on an issue on Github at https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/issues/237307#issuecomment-2017437870 | 16:17:23 |
| @delroth:delroth.net | to be clear re: "mob programming", and to put numbers on things: the 2023 SoN report claims "Knowledge sharing: Mob programming is very effective" while also saying SoN spent 3225.5h at 25.52€/h packaging 5 projects | 16:17:40 |
| @delroth:delroth.net | that's one project per month | 16:17:54 |
| ronef | I haven't been personally looking into it but I'm happy to
Agreed that SoN is a critical project that can have lots of good impact! | 16:18:24 |
| Pol | SoN, Mob, <call-it-whatever>, if there's no contribution back, it's almost pointless. | 16:19:22 |
| @delroth:delroth.net | Pol: the written documents claim that the aim is to upstream stuff but all the actions from the SoN admins go against that - the existence of ngipkgs is almost on its own an admission that their effort can't actually meet normal nixpkgs quality standards | 16:21:20 |
| @delroth:delroth.net | (and like, normal nixpkgs quality standards aren't high, but for example https://github.com/ngi-nix/ngipkgs/blob/main/pkgs/by-name/freeDiameter/package.nix wouldn't pass...) | 16:21:32 |
| @delroth:delroth.net | (for very good reasons) | 16:21:36 |
| ronef | What's the biggest problem items today from your perspective?
Seems to me that there's a value problem, velocity? | 16:21:48 |
| Pol | I know, I have been asked for helped in the ngipkgs repo, I was really surprised that stuff were merged as-is. | 16:22:02 |
