| 13 May 2025 |
 K900 | Overall better policy would be great | 12:35:56 |
| K900 | e.g. trusted users being allowed to post images | 12:36:07 |
| K900 | Some protections for low entropy messages/repeated messages | 12:36:24 |
| K900 | Maybe some implementation of knocking-via-bot | 12:37:47 |
| K900 | Though that could be out of scope for Draupnir | 12:37:53 |
 Cat | Knocking via? | 12:38:20 |
| Cat | I am confused about what exactly you’re thinking about. | 12:38:55 |
| K900 | Basically being able to DM Draupnir to "knock" | 12:39:47 |
| K900 | Because client support for knocking is basically non-existent | 12:40:15 |
 @magic_rb:matrix.redalder.org | Ah and draupnir then sends the invite. The problem is still the lack of discoverability | 12:41:13 |
| @magic_rb:matrix.redalder.org | Would it be possible to somehow detect failed joins and automatically invite the user to a DM | 12:41:29 |
| K900 | We can think of discoverability when we've addressed safety | 12:41:40 |
| K900 | No | 12:41:45 |
| Cat | In reply to @k900:0upti.me
Basically being able to DM Draupnir to "knock" That sounds like a completely reasonable solution to that knocking has no gui. To have a knock bot. Be that Draupnir or something else. | 12:42:23 |
 adamcstephens | And how would a user know about this? | 12:42:44 |
| K900 | As an example, we could have a public room that is set to read-only | 12:43:14 |
| K900 | Containing instructions to DM the knock bot and be invited to the private room | 12:43:25 |
| K900 | But again, I don't care about discoverability right now | 12:43:35 |
| @magic_rb:matrix.redalder.org | NixOS - JOIN HERE FIRST | 12:43:36 |
| K900 | What I care about is not getting the existing rooms spammed to death | 12:43:56 |
| @magic_rb:matrix.redalder.org | writing a knock bot cant be that hard, i dont have the time, but it doesnt seem to bad | 12:44:19 |
| K900 | If we make things discoverable and all people discover are 30 pages of \n mentions and shock content, we did not win | 12:44:24 |
| K900 | Quite the opposite really | 12:44:31 |
| adamcstephens | I understand that's your focus, but I am worried that we're missing the bigger picture in an effort to combat this spam. And if we can't get what we need, and a user reasonable way, we should seriously consider whether matrix is the right solution. | 12:46:26 |
| adamcstephens | * I understand that's your focus, but I am worried that we're missing the bigger picture in an effort to combat this spam. And if we can't get what we need, in a user reasonable way, we should seriously consider whether matrix is the right solution. | 12:46:52 |
| K900 | Well if you know another platform that isn't proprietary and has better moderation tools | 12:47:02 |
| K900 | I'm all ears | 12:47:19 |
 truh | Is this community specifically getting targeted or is it the same in other matrix communities?
I'm worried that if it's an automated process with multiple steps, that's actually quite easy for bots to perform but very annoying for regular users. | 12:47:34 |
| K900 | I fully recognize Matrix sucks but we also need to recognize that everything else generally tends to suck more | 12:47:39 |
 emily | I pretty confidently predict that we wouldn't be getting this spam if we used Zulip. I'm not saying that's because Zulip has solved moderation problems that Matrix hasn't but I'm relatively sure the cultural context and lack of federation means that it wouldn't be happening. | 12:47:45 |
