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Sender	Message	Time
24 Nov 2024
p14	Good guess: https://github.com/llvm/llvm-project/commit/5b77e752dcd073846b89559d6c0e1a7699e58615	15:54:17
@paparodeo:matrix.org	I have an open PR that modifies that code, so was looking at it recently. https://github.com/llvm/llvm-project/pull/116476	15:55:00
emily	maybe we can backport that	19:22:19
@paparodeo:matrix.org	patch applies to clang [14-16] will need to be adjusted for 12 & 13 due to failing to patch hunk 2 file 1	21:45:55
@paparodeo:matrix.org	In reply to @emilazy:matrix.org maybe we can backport that backported with: https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/pull/358836 currently building irods with patch. will mark as ready once completed.	22:40:59
emily	sometimes it feels like we're backporting half the commits in LLVM to older versions	22:43:03
Tristan Ross	In reply to @emilazy:matrix.org sometimes it feels like we're backporting half the commits in LLVM to older versions Well now it should be easier with the common stuff. Getting patches works nicely.	22:45:23
emily	hopefully it won't be too long until we can just use new LLVMs rather than trying to make old LLVMs into them :)	22:47:29
Tristan Ross	That's what I'm hoping for	22:50:14
emily	I will probably remove some non-contiguous LLVMs when I get bored	22:51:43
@paparodeo:matrix.org	14,16,17,18 might be easy to remove though 17-18 haven't been around for that long.	22:54:42
Tristan Ross	I would hold off removing newer LLVM versions	22:55:57
emily	I think things below 18 can go.	22:57:14
emily	(when not otherwise needed)	22:57:20
emily	since 18 has been the default and anyway Darwin has already dealt with the pain of moving off 16.	22:57:48
emily	honestly even 18 could probably go if the next `staging-next` goes okay. we've not had that bad a time fixing `char_traits` stuff	22:59:27
Tristan Ross	In reply to @emilazy:matrix.org I think things below 18 can go. Yeah, I agree. It's just things which are relatively newer and it's probably easier to handle conflicts and removing version checks when it's older first.	23:11:04
emily	the older ones tend to be the harder ones to remove	23:12:14
emily	since stuff stuck on very old LLVMs is harder to make work on new ones	23:12:23
Tristan Ross	Hmm then we probably will have problems either way	23:14:42
emily	I don't think it's that hard to remove version checks for a specific version?	23:16:12
emily	it's just a gap	23:16:14
emily	we have lots of packages with non-contiguous versions, e.g. Boost.	23:16:23
25 Nov 2024
Philip Taron (UTC-8)	In reply to @rosscomputerguy:matrix.org emily John Ericson Philip Taron (UTC-8) Randy Eckenrode & Artturin: have you guys seen this post (https://discourse.nixos.org/t/community-team-updates/56458) should we do a meeting to discuss things to add for a reply to the post or do we just want to message in here? I'm up for a Zoom or other video meetup. Here's the list of things I'm tracking in stdenv world. `__structuredAttrs` https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/issues/205690. Mostly driven by @wolfgangwalthier. Thank you! Various improvements to fetchgit,fetchGitHub, etc, mostly around `rev` vs. `tag` to increase the expressiveness of the function. Improvements to `nixpkgs` configuration options to document and regularize those options (https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/pull/330753, but the PR author has left nixpkgs) Structured logging (`@nix { "action": "msg", "level": "1", "msg": ...}`) support in the stdenv. https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/pull/331794 Thorough removal of `substituteAll` in the nixpkgs codebase: https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/issues/237216 Continued progress on clarifying what the environment is and what guarantees are possible across "releases". Linters and checkers (like `nixpkgs-vet`) that assist with in-tree and out-of-tree users to provide diagnostics and migrations for necessary changes. Breaking apart the knot of bootstrapping on every platform to enable a stdenv that's "bootstrap-free" -- not strangely constrained by bootstrap concerns, but able to be changed without breaking bootstrap. Making sense of how cross-compilation depends and does not depend on stdenv. (This is a personal goal, since I just don't understand it today.) There are other small things, but this is the majority effort.	00:21:05
emily	what do you mean by #8?	00:35:36
Tristan Ross	In reply to @philiptaron:matrix.org I'm up for a Zoom or other video meetup. Here's the list of things I'm tracking in stdenv world. `__structuredAttrs` https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/issues/205690. Mostly driven by @wolfgangwalthier. Thank you! Various improvements to fetchgit,fetchGitHub, etc, mostly around `rev` vs. `tag` to increase the expressiveness of the function. Improvements to `nixpkgs` configuration options to document and regularize those options (https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/pull/330753, but the PR author has left nixpkgs) Structured logging (`@nix { "action": "msg", "level": "1", "msg": ...}`) support in the stdenv. https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/pull/331794 Thorough removal of `substituteAll` in the nixpkgs codebase: https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/issues/237216 Continued progress on clarifying what the environment is and what guarantees are possible across "releases". Linters and checkers (like `nixpkgs-vet`) that assist with in-tree and out-of-tree users to provide diagnostics and migrations for necessary changes. Breaking apart the knot of bootstrapping on every platform to enable a stdenv that's "bootstrap-free" -- not strangely constrained by bootstrap concerns, but able to be changed without breaking bootstrap. Making sense of how cross-compilation depends and does not depend on stdenv. (This is a personal goal, since I just don't understand it today.) There are other small things, but this is the majority effort. Ok, we can schedule based on availability. I think there's the crab fit thing which can be used to track availability.	00:39:25
Tristan Ross	Could do a meeting over jitsi	00:40:33
Philip Taron (UTC-8)	In reply to @emilazy:matrix.org what do you mean by #8? It’s sort of mixed up with #9. I worked for a short while with John Ericsson on breaking apart the GCC derivations into multiple derivations instead of one giant derivation. Stuff like your patch that needed lib.getExe in order not to break cross compilation. Making sense of what exactly the cc wrapper is and does.	00:54:54
Philip Taron (UTC-8)	I notice basically everyone who tackles something with bootstrap breaks something. Why? What can we do to make this less common?	00:55:46
Philip Taron (UTC-8)	In reply to @philiptaron:matrix.org I notice basically everyone who tackles something with bootstrap breaks something. Why? What can we do to make this less common? Something = a meaningful change rather than just keeping the lights on.	00:56:17

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