| 9 May 2026 |
 hexa (signing key rotation when) | right | 20:20:52 |
 emily | I think a nicer solution is ^ where you just never push out a .narinfo for any output until all the outputs are up | 20:21:13 |
| emily | but looking at the C++ code it doesn't seem like that would be trivial to arrange if S3 can even do it | 20:21:29 |
| emily | and obviously I don't know how the new queue runner will handle uploads (maybe John Ericson does) | 20:21:44 |
| hexa (signing key rotation when) | Simon Hauser would know | 20:22:08 |
| emily | it seems like just increasing the number of retries in the Nix config specifically used by the queue runner would likely mitigate this problem in practice for now | 20:22:13 |
| hexa (signing key rotation when) | fair enough | 20:22:29 |
| hexa (signing key rotation when) | let's say 32 instead of 1024 though | 20:22:37 |
 John Ericson | I do agree with that sort of thing | 20:23:49 |
| John Ericson | (well in the CA case, it would be the build trace entry, but I digress :)) | 20:24:04 |
| emily | in the CA case the Darwin builds will be broken 100% of the time so there'll be much less debugging required to find the root cause :P | 20:24:37 |
| John Ericson | no more automatic rewriting in CA soon! :) | 20:26:12 |
| emily | how is that going to work? | 20:26:42 |
| John Ericson | https://github.com/NixOS/nix/pull/15793 see what Artemis has been working on | 20:27:51 |
| John Ericson | (note that the use of the exing protocol vs a new simpler protocol is provisional) | 20:28:07 |
| hexa (signing key rotation when) | how annoying would it be to move the S3 bucket to Europe btw 😆 | 20:28:54 |
| emily | I don't see how this solves every dylib on Darwin encoding its own path? | 20:29:51 |
| emily | "The builder can learn the calculated content-addressed path of one of its outputs before creating others" sounds like it can only prevent breaking cross-output references (and since you usually need to know all paths upfront at ./configure time probably not even then) | 20:30:12 |
| emily | but offtopic, anyway :) | 20:30:14 |
|  @squalus0:matrix.org left the room. | 21:21:39 |
| 10 May 2026 |
 vcunat | In reply to @emilazy:matrix.org
right, okay. I don't know exactly why it happens but I know vcunat has mentioned it happening multiple times before. To me the behavior looked like insufficient deduplication of the situations where different hydra jobs built the same derivation, e.g. on different jobsets. It seemed easy to happen. We're helped by the ratio of job count to build times usually, as the duplication only happens concurrently. And for linux we get helped by the builder pool being small and split along the big-parallel axis, so often the duplicate got scheduled to the same machine and deduplicated locally by nix in there. | 06:27:16 |
|  Marcel joined the room. | 12:45:09 |
| John Ericson | I think we should disable fallback paths | 15:13:06 |
| John Ericson | It seems like this feature is not being helpful at all | 15:13:20 |
| John Ericson | And it would be better to fail or delete the outputs first | 15:13:38 |
 K900 | Problem with delete the outputs is they may be in use | 15:14:09 |
| K900 | Problem with fail is Hydra needs to be smart enough to handle this | 15:14:20 |
| K900 | But ideally yes we should fail | 15:14:25 |
| hexa (signing key rotation when) | not sure who restarted ip2unix on nixos/unstable, but it's stuck on a test | 17:13:30 |
| John Ericson | there will be temp roots if they are in use | 17:13:29 |
