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Nix Documentation

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Discussion about documentation improvements around the Nix ecosystem80 Servers

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1 Mar 2024
@jade_:matrix.org@jade_:matrix.org segv doesn't tell you anything, please coredumpctl debug if this is Linux and give the back trace (type bt into gdb) 19:18:08
@jade_:matrix.org@jade_:matrix.orgthank you19:18:11
@qyliss:fairydust.spaceAlyssa RossC++ is not ABI-compatible between GCC and Clang, so you can't build some things with GCC, some with Clang, and then link them together.19:19:04
@qyliss:fairydust.spaceAlyssa RossIf you override Nix to build with Clang, boost will still be built with GCC19:19:14
@qyliss:fairydust.spaceAlyssa RossSo it's not expected to work.19:19:29
@qyliss:fairydust.spaceAlyssa RossIf the Nix flake is doing this, it should stop.19:20:17
@qyliss:fairydust.spaceAlyssa Rossah, but it looks like it actually overrides stdenv in an overlay, so I guess that should work?19:21:10
@qyliss:fairydust.spaceAlyssa RossIt's very hard to read19:21:12
@qyliss:fairydust.spaceAlyssa RossAh, no, the overlay only applies the custom stdenv to Nix19:22:26
@qyliss:fairydust.spaceAlyssa RossSo it won't work19:22:28
@qyliss:fairydust.spaceAlyssa Rosscc Ericson2314 19:22:30
@qyliss:fairydust.spaceAlyssa Ross(It might not actually be ABI compatibility that's the problem — I just remember that it's definitely not expected for this to work)19:31:41
@Ericson2314:matrix.orgJohn Ericson Alyssa Ross: if you are using --gcc-toolchain as we are on Linux, isn't it supposed to be ABI compatible? 21:27:53
@Ericson2314:matrix.orgJohn Ericson(more precisely, it is using at least parts of libstdc++ and friends so the ABI is the same?)21:28:49
@Ericson2314:matrix.orgJohn EricsonI don't fully get it but I always do clang development builds (mainly out of habit) and don't think I had a problem yet21:29:28
@qyliss:fairydust.spaceAlyssa Rosshmm, maybe it is?21:31:15
@qyliss:fairydust.spaceAlyssa RossI'm not sure21:31:26
@qyriad:matrix.org@qyriad:matrix.orgclangStdenv links libgcc and libstdc++ on Linux, as is the default for Clang on Linux23:37:45
@qyliss:fairydust.spaceAlyssa RossI definitely remember it being a problem before, but maybe it wasn't always this way.23:39:51
2 Mar 2024
@delroth:delroth.net@delroth:delroth.nethi there - what is the current "tech stack" recommendation for writing new documentation for currently undocumented projects in the Nix ecosystem? in this case, mostly internal facing (github.com/nixos/infra), if it changes anything03:23:33
@delroth:delroth.net@delroth:delroth.net(my ideal requirements: proper multipage support with navigation, markdown or at least not docbook, preferably a stylesheet that's not straight out of the 90s)03:25:40
@delroth:delroth.net@delroth:delroth.net(this sounds like something which should be documented, maybe with templates, btw :P but I didn't find anything after some quick research)03:26:31
@danielsidhion:nixos.devdanielsidhion
In reply to @delroth:delroth.net
hi there - what is the current "tech stack" recommendation for writing new documentation for currently undocumented projects in the Nix ecosystem? in this case, mostly internal facing (github.com/nixos/infra), if it changes anything
There is no recommendation 🥲
We have at least 3 different toolchains used throughout all our docs and want to find a way to reduce that amount (ideally to 1 toolchain), but afaik we haven't yet put the effort to see what things would fit our needs the best
05:05:46
@danielsidhion:nixos.devdanielsidhionI literally got started on this exploration today. I want to make some internal nixpkgs docs (all the readme.md files) more visible, so I'm on a similar path as you05:07:55
@qyriad:katesiria.orgQyriad joined the room.06:25:18
@qyriad:katesiria.orgQyriad 06:27:35
@fricklerhandwerk:matrix.orgfricklerhandwerk

delroth: Slightly more practically speaking (although generally my response would also be a deep sigh), if you only have prose and no or little structured data, I recommend to write things into markdown files and link them from the README. GitHub is the entry point for most of everything, and from that perspective it’s the most straightforward thing to do.

If you do have mainly structured data, you’ll have to program it anyway, and in that case it basically doesn’t matter how you do it. It would be great though if you kept it simple relative to the minimal tech stack needed to contribute to Nix. I have my gripes with mdBook and Sphinx, because those are frameworks that assume certain things that usually don’t fit out use case all that much; and they are not really programmable to adapt them accordingly, and any attempt will make things very messy.

nix-render-docs is a bit of a monster for backward-compatibility reasons, but actually a good example for how to do it well: it’s a purpose-built, highly structured Python program that transforms whatever there is to be documented about in Nixpkgs into a web page.

11:10:37
@fricklerhandwerk:matrix.orgfricklerhandwerk *

delroth: Slightly more practically speaking (although generally my response would also be a deep sigh), if you only have prose and no or little structured data, I recommend to write things into markdown files and link them from the README. GitHub is the entry point for most of everything, and from that perspective it’s the most straightforward thing to do.

If you do have mainly structured data, you’ll have to program it anyway, and in that case it basically doesn’t matter how you do it. It would be great though if you kept it simple relative to the minimal tech stack needed to contribute to Nix. I have my gripes with mdBook and Sphinx, because those are frameworks that assume certain things that usually don’t fit our use cases all that much; and they are not really programmable to adapt them accordingly, and any attempt will make things very messy.

nix-render-docs is a bit of a monster for backward-compatibility reasons, but actually a good example for how to do it well: it’s a purpose-built, highly structured Python program that transforms whatever there is to be documented about in Nixpkgs into a web page.

11:11:32
@fricklerhandwerk:matrix.orgfricklerhandwerk *

delroth: Slightly more practically speaking (although generally my response would also be a deep sigh), if you only have prose and no or little structured data, I recommend to write things into markdown files and link them from the README. GitHub is the entry point for most of everything, and from that perspective it’s the most straightforward thing to do.

If you do have mainly structured data, you’ll have to program it anyway, and in that case it basically doesn’t matter how you do it. It would be great though if you kept it simple relative to the minimal tech stack needed to contribute to Nix. I have my gripes with mdBook and Sphinx, because those are frameworks that assume certain things that usually don’t fit our use cases all that well; and they are not really programmable to adapt them accordingly, and any attempt will make things very messy.

nix-render-docs is a bit of a monster for backward-compatibility reasons, but actually a good example for how to do it well: it’s a purpose-built, highly structured Python program that transforms whatever there is to be documented about in Nixpkgs into a web page.

11:11:53
@delroth:delroth.net@delroth:delroth.net
In reply to @fricklerhandwerk:matrix.org

delroth: Slightly more practically speaking (although generally my response would also be a deep sigh), if you only have prose and no or little structured data, I recommend to write things into markdown files and link them from the README. GitHub is the entry point for most of everything, and from that perspective it’s the most straightforward thing to do.

If you do have mainly structured data, you’ll have to program it anyway, and in that case it basically doesn’t matter how you do it. It would be great though if you kept it simple relative to the minimal tech stack needed to contribute to Nix. I have my gripes with mdBook and Sphinx, because those are frameworks that assume certain things that usually don’t fit our use cases all that well; and they are not really programmable to adapt them accordingly, and any attempt will make things very messy.

nix-render-docs is a bit of a monster for backward-compatibility reasons, but actually a good example for how to do it well: it’s a purpose-built, highly structured Python program that transforms whatever there is to be documented about in Nixpkgs into a web page.

I wouldn't call markdown files in GitHub "proper multipage / navigation support" though :/
11:14:59

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