| 24 Nov 2025 |
 K900 | If this is all it takes | 11:41:13 |
 niklaskorz | Mesa 26 final will release in February, so still plenty of time to iron out the details, and lots of buffer for 26.05 breaking changes 😄 | 11:47:41 |
 Randy Eckenrode | I was hoping Mesa 26.0 would land later because having to support Intel hardware complicates things. If it requires macOS 26, that also complicates things. | 12:07:25 |
| Randy Eckenrode | It’s likely we will need to patch vulkan-loader to fall back to MoltenVK in that case (until macOS 26 is the baseline). | 12:08:01 |
| niklaskorz | I'm on macOS 15 and KosmicKrisp runs fine | 12:09:07 |
| niklaskorz | (can't speak for x86 though) | 12:09:23 |
| K900 | Can we just not | 12:10:12 |
| niklaskorz | oh wait, I see it requires macOS 26 for recent changes... | 12:10:29 |
| Randy Eckenrode | https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa/-/issues?label_name%5B%5D=KosmicKrisp&show=eyJpaWQiOiIxNDI2NSIsImZ1bGxfcGF0aCI6Im1lc2EvbWVzYSIsImlkIjoxNDM0ODl9 is talking about making Metal 4 a requirement. | 12:10:32 |
| niklaskorz | yeah uhm | 12:10:52 |
| niklaskorz | not great | 12:10:54 |
| Randy Eckenrode | * | 12:11:03 |
| niklaskorz | but it's not set it in stone, judging from the issue discussion | 12:11:50 |
| Randy Eckenrode | Advertising macOS 14 or 15 as the minimum while having applications like mpv just not work is probably not what we want. | 12:11:55 |
| K900 | I mean we can just not build the Vulkan backend on x86_64 no? | 12:12:31 |
| K900 | Actually we can probably yes build it | 12:12:31 |
| K900 | And then just not have a driver | 12:12:31 |
| niklaskorz | they only merged the MTLResidencySet PR so far but that does not require macOS 26 | 12:12:57 |
| Randy Eckenrode | We want KosmicKrisp on x86_64 for Wine. | 12:14:55 |
| K900 | Oof | 12:15:29 |
| K900 | OK yeah | 12:15:30 |
| K900 | Oof | 12:15:30 |
| Randy Eckenrode | I may try to get the ARM64EC version of Wine building, but the FEX situation on Darwin is not great AFAIK. | 12:16:22 |
| Randy Eckenrode | Swift comes first, which I plan to get back to doing sometime this week. | 12:16:56 |
| niklaskorz | so Tom tried KosmicKrisp instead of MoltenVK for Tiny Glade, which does ray marching and all, and... it's about 4x slower than MoltenVK at the moment | 14:09:27 |
| niklaskorz | might be better to not default to KosmicKrisp right on Mesa 26 release day | 14:09:50 |
| niklaskorz | * might be better not to default to KosmicKrisp right on Mesa 26 release day | 14:09:56 |
| niklaskorz | but that might speak in favor of making use of those Metal 4 APIs | 14:10:31 |
| niklaskorz | * but that might speak in favor of making use of those Metal 4 APIs (for upstream, it's not a decision for us to make) | 14:10:42 |
| Randy Eckenrode | Correct but slow is better than fast but wrong. I expect KosmicKrisp to improve performance faster than MoltenVK to improve conformance. | 14:21:34 |
