Nix on macOS | 1222 Members | |
| “There are still many issues with the Darwin platform but most of it is quite usable.” — http://yves.gnu-darwin.org | 202 Servers |
| Sender | Message | Time |
|---|---|---|
| 22 May 2026 | ||
| yeah, with certainty | 21:11:12 | |
| 1.94.x -> 1.95.0 | 21:11:19 | |
| I have no capacity to take care of that | 21:11:33 | |
| https://paste.lossy.network/WSLLAOC4XUVLMMIS2R7L4SSILY | 21:26:20 | |
| https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2041825 | 21:31:06 | |
| filed | 21:31:09 | |
| Looks a lot like: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2038918 except it is a different type and platform | 21:38:32 | |
| 23 May 2026 | ||
| Stage is open for breaking changes again, right? What’s our timeline on dropping x86_64-darwin support? | 00:41:13 | |
| * | 00:41:22 | |
| 09:17:46 | ||
| emily wanted to be pinged 3 days before the new staging-next opens up iirfc | 12:08:14 | |
| Redacted or Malformed Event | 12:08:17 | |
| Redacted or Malformed Event | 12:08:21 | |
| 15:40:54 | ||
| 18:23:15 | ||
| 24 May 2026 | ||
I have the core changes all ready to go, yeah (and open PRs already). the WIP stuff I wanted a few days notice for is just finishing triaging stuff that dropping a platform regresses (e.g. a lot of binary packages have update scripts that will break when x86_64-darwin does) – I have commits for it but they're messy. | 18:01:10 | |
| I did want us to resolve the Wine question though. carving out just that package and its revdep tree would be easy / minimal maintenance and builder load, especially if we drop it as soon as it poses issues or we have a viable replacement and if some of the Linux-centric deps can be dropped. it's just slightly awkward timing – I suspect that CrossOver is going to come out with something during the macOS 27 lifetime given their collaboration with Apple and the Rosetta changes coming in macOS 28. having a period between now and then where macOS users can't get an up-to-date / supported Wine at all feels a bit unfortunate. it's just a matter of whether I drop the few changes that would need to be elided to carve out a | 18:05:50 | |
| I was really hoping that we'd have a working native Wine + FEX/Rosetta situation by now tbh | 18:07:05 | |
| The macOS incompatibilities are going to be a blocker unless Apple does something. | 18:52:18 | |
| Though in addition to the entitlement, it’s possible Apple may just tell developers to test with GPTK in a macOS 27 VM. Since it’s not intended for production use, that might be “good enough” for whatever they’re supposed to use it for. | 18:53:01 | |
| Maybe we’ll find out more at WWDC. It would certainly be helpful to know how exactly older games are expected to work in the future. | 18:54:11 | |
| those incompatibilities are about running native Windows ARM code though, they're not necessarily a blocker to emulating x86 apps (but since CodeWeavers announced years ago they'd be ready when Rosetta 2 gets dropped and since Apple have specifically signalled legacy games as something the remaining Rosetta 2 is going to be there to support, I think there's pretty much a guarantee that something gets worked out, or already has been behind the scenes) | 18:54:45 | |
| The emulation is implemented Windows-side in Wine, so you need to be able to run native Windows on ARM to use FEX. | 18:55:43 | |
| my best guess is
maybe leaning towards the latter at this point… I think Apple would love to be able to drop support from the system frameworks and shrink the download. I always read "Beyond this timeframe, we will keep a subset of Rosetta functionality aimed at supporting older unmaintained gaming titles, that rely on Intel-based frameworks." as meaning Intel-based | 18:56:20 | |
| sure, but CodeWeavers employ a bunch of Wine devs, and they've also done stuff like e.g. make 32-bit x86 code keep working post-Catalina by shimming stuff themselves | 18:56:55 | |
| so making it work differently seems well within the kind of thing they've done in the past. whether it'll make its way to upstream Wine – not sure… | 18:57:16 | |
| Supporting Wine but not actual Mac games that are stuck on x86_64 seems crazy. | 18:57:39 | |
| I think there's zero chance that Wine just completely breaks by macOS 28 though. Apple might not care that much about games, but CrossOver is a pretty big deal. | 18:58:10 | |
| and if they were willing to let it die then they wouldn't need any Rosetta 2 carve-out at all tbh | 18:58:27 | |
| slimming it down to the core ISA emulation because Wine already handles adapting the system APIs makes a lot of sense from a reducing maintenance burden perspective too | 18:58:50 | |