| 6 May 2025 |
 hexa | right | 17:19:49 |
| hexa | but it exists and it pays the bills | 17:19:54 |
 adamcstephens | i use cloud-init for non-nixos, on the rare occasion i spin one up, but i'm also only interested in bootstrapping my user environment | 17:22:14 |
| hexa | I don't get the appeal of full os containers tbh | 17:22:32 |
| hexa | feels like a nieche | 17:22:50 |
| hexa | * feels like a niche | 17:23:16 |
| adamcstephens | i use them so that there's not the VM overhead, but allows me to keep services off the host. | 17:23:22 |
| adamcstephens | there is less isolation though, so it's a trade off | 17:23:45 |
| hexa | yeah, for services that I care about there is systemd hardening | 17:24:00 |
| hexa | so I do run them on the host, privately of course | 17:24:10 |
| adamcstephens | yeah, that should be sufficient if the service is hardened | 17:28:47 |
 Cobalt | In reply to @hexa:lossy.network
I don't get the appeal of full os containers tbh ProxMox (as much of a niche as it is) uses them quite well. They feel mostly like VMs, eliding some isolation, but the ease of admin (resizing storage, memory/CPU changes on the fly) is nice. Proxmox + LXC also integrates quite well | 18:48:32 |
| Cobalt | * ProxMox (as much of a niche as it is) uses them quite well. They feel mostly like VMs, eliding some isolation, but the ease of admin (resizing storage, memory/CPU changes on the fly) is nice. Proxmox + LXC also integrates quite well with NixOS | 18:49:59 |
| adamcstephens | That's consistent with how you work with them in incus. They're just a separate instance type | 19:09:23 |
| hexa | Thanks, but I'm staying far away from Proxmox. | 19:09:40 |
| hexa | It is a shitty webfocused stack written in Perl and some Rust these days | 19:09:56 |
| hexa | But they still can't do automatic placement | 19:10:08 |
| hexa | and they don't support in place upgrades | 19:10:16 |
| adamcstephens | What? How do you upgrade it then? | 19:16:30 |
| hexa | reboot | 19:34:42 |
| Cobalt | In reply to @hexa:lossy.network
and they don't support in place upgrades Are you sure about that? I can just apt dist-upgrade which should get everything except the kernel. | 20:06:22 |
| Cobalt | Or am I misunderstanding how they do updates there? | 20:06:40 |
| hexa | install needrestart and find out | 20:08:13 |
| hexa | if you restart its services it will fence the host in a cluster | 20:08:26 |
| hexa | * if you restart its services it will fence the host in a cluster setup | 20:08:28 |
| hexa | you absolutely cannot restart some of its services | 20:08:38 |
| hexa | which is absolutely possible with incus (and ganeti, which Ive used for years befoer) | 20:08:53 |
| hexa | proxmox is the badly designed outlier here | 20:09:02 |
| hexa | they also don't control the basis for the cluster protocol, which is based on corosync | 20:09:37 |
| Cobalt | In reply to @hexa:lossy.network
install needrestart and find out Thanks for that hint, I should likely restart my hosts more often then. | 20:10:10 |
