| 24 Nov 2021 |
| *  joepie91 🏳️🌈 appears | 10:22:33 |
| joepie91 🏳️🌈 | In reply to @zimbatm:numtide.com
Especially mediation techniques is pretty interesting to me. I would rather people resolve their issues with one another rather than resorting to blocks. Blocks are sort of a bandaid. They create weird situations where people speak in the void because the other party has blocked them. It's a useful tool but it's also degrading the community as a whole. I strongly agree with this, ftr | 10:22:55 |
| joepie91 🏳️🌈 | like, very very strongly | 10:23:04 |
 Irenes | me too | 10:23:22 |
| Irenes | I think I'm on record saying that repeatedly | 10:23:27 |
 @zimbatm:numtide.com | being able to beta test some of the ideas would be really good | 10:23:31 |
| Irenes | but in case I'm not, I'll say it again | 10:23:33 |
| Irenes | sure, that makes sense | 10:23:49 |
| Irenes | I think blocks are necessary and would exist even in my ideal state, but I also think any time they actually happen it's a strong indication that something went wrong | 10:24:10 |
| joepie91 🏳️🌈 | In reply to @zimbatm:numtide.com
Is there any source material that we can use to learn more about the topic? there's a lot of this material in anarchist theory, but that is maybe not the most accessible option here. if I recall correctly, Freenode used to have a mediation policy that went into some amount of detail about this, but I'm unsure whether it survived the move to Libera | 10:24:45 |
| joepie91 🏳️🌈 | ah, it has! | 10:25:03 |
| joepie91 🏳️🌈 | https://libera.chat/guides/catalyst | 10:25:04 |
| Irenes | ooh | 10:25:09 |
| joepie91 🏳️🌈 | it is somewhat specific to IRC mechanisms but still addresses some de-escalation techniques | 10:25:21 |
| Irenes | right, yeah when I'm rested I can definitely go into detail on this | 10:25:31 |
| Irenes | or rather | 10:25:35 |
| Irenes | probably better if zimbatm leads the conversation but I do have thoughts on how each of these headings plays out in practice | 10:25:51 |
| Irenes | I agree with very nearly all of them | 10:25:58 |
| @zimbatm:numtide.com | thanks, I will have to take some time to read this | 10:26:15 |
| Irenes | and the parts I don't agree with are still true sometimes, just I've seen them be oppressive too | 10:26:16 |
| joepie91 🏳️🌈 | I haven't read the Libera version yet, but the Freenode version did suffer from some cultural holdovers, so it should probably be read with that context in mind - this was written like two decades ago | 10:26:33 |
| Irenes | sure | 10:26:53 |
| joepie91 🏳️🌈 | doesn't make it not useful, just affects the lens to read it through :) | 10:27:00 |
| @zimbatm:numtide.com | how I see it, a lot of what we do is based on daily practices and cultural norms | 10:27:31 |
| @zimbatm:numtide.com | adding all of that to the RFC would make it super long | 10:27:45 |
| Irenes | sure | 10:28:04 |
| @zimbatm:numtide.com | or in most law systems there is the law, and then the interpretation of the court, which is also used | 10:28:17 |
| Irenes | which is why we focused on specifying the very high level philosophy stuff, and creating a process that will allow those norms to persist | 10:28:27 |
| Irenes | but who knows, it may be that the right way really is to spell out all those cultural norms | 10:28:35 |
| joepie91 🏳️🌈 | Jonas Chevalier: as a shorthand answer, the single most reliably effective tool for de-escalation that I have seen is having some people on hand (with or without a formal moderation role) who are able and willing to mediate from an outsider perspective in a conflict, a conflict that they are not personally close to | 10:28:37 |
