| 23 Jul 2021 |
 davidak | "You’ve got to start with the customer experience and work backward to the technology. You can’t start with the technology then try to figure out where to sell it."
https://www.horsesforsources.com/steve-jobs1997_080820 (with video)
i got the quote from this video at 12:33 (can't link because chromium is broken on nixos unstable and can't display text)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SFBoB6xijY
| 03:23:24 |
| davidak | i think that's what we try to do with nix and nixos, especially the people in this room. try to sell a product that no one asked for and most even say they don't need it (see hackernews comments on nixos) | 03:24:59 |
| davidak | on the other hand look what elementary OS, Pop_OS! and SteamOS does | 03:25:40 |
 David Arnold (blaggacao) | I think a declarative system is like painting a picture. It's such a great thing for people who like to keep their environment tidy. Maybe we could start from there? | 03:26:42 |
| David Arnold (blaggacao) | * I think a declarative model is like painting a picture. It's such a great thing for people who like to keep their environment tidy. Maybe we could start from there? | 03:26:57 |
| David Arnold (blaggacao) | * I think a declarative model is like painting a picture. It's such a great thing for people who like to keep their environment tidy. Maybe we could start from there? | 03:27:32 |
| David Arnold (blaggacao) | "NixOS - (almost) draw your system" | 03:28:36 |
| David Arnold (blaggacao) | This makes me think of those draw by numbers leaflets for children. As an analogy, maybe we can have something that helps/guids people "draw" their NixOs system... | 03:29:44 |
| David Arnold (blaggacao) | * This makes me think of those draw by numbers leaflets for children. As an analogy, maybe we can have something that helps/guides people "draw" their NixOs system... | 03:29:54 |
 matthewcroughan - nix.how | more like carving a statue :P | 03:30:10 |
| David Arnold (blaggacao) | * This makes me think of those draw by numbers leaflets for children. As an analogy, maybe we can have something that helps/guides people "draw" their NixOS system... | 03:30:10 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.how | made of stone, not of ice | 03:30:22 |
| David Arnold (blaggacao) | I think it appeals to "designers" and "composers", since "crafting" a system is oftentimes a piece of art. | 03:31:29 |
| David Arnold (blaggacao) | * I think it appeals to "designers" and "composers", since "crafting" a system is oftentimes a piece of art. And people seem to enjoy to build the entire "whole" out of a single stone. | 03:32:18 |
| David Arnold (blaggacao) | This is dramatically incompatible with the functional model os system administration. | 03:33:15 |
| David Arnold (blaggacao) | * This is dramatically incompatible with the functional model of system administration. | 03:33:24 |
| David Arnold (blaggacao) | I think that "system designer" is not too bad of a user persona. (Not the only one, sure!) | 03:34:16 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.how | I think Nix is CAD for computer systems. | 03:34:45 |
| David Arnold (blaggacao) | Maybe we can find an adjacent but more mass market persona? | 03:34:48 |
| davidak | that's what sysadmins do. most computer users are no sysadmins
like most car drivers don't build the car from scratch | 03:34:54 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.how | You know how FreeCAD/Fusion360 are? They help you design objects that you'll manufacture in the real world. Nix helps you design computer systems. | 03:35:04 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.how | computer aided design | 03:35:12 |
| davidak | to really be mainstream and beginner-friendly, we have to hide all technology and it has to work like Pop_OS!. look at the install, onboarding, updating experience | 03:35:50 |
| David Arnold (blaggacao) | In reply to @davidak:matrix.org
that's what sysadmins do. most computer users are no sysadmins
like most car drivers don't build the car from scratch Yep, I agree! But maybe there is a persona that we can fish in the neighboring pond, not too far away from our origin waters? | 03:35:59 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.how | Depends if we really want to pretend that this is what we are. | 03:36:16 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.how | Nix is a programming language, it has to remain that way. | 03:36:30 |
| davidak | with nixos technology, it can be more robust and stable, but leave a lot of power for more advanced users | 03:36:35 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.how | And by being that, it is automatically off-limits to a lot of people. We can make interfaces, make it easier, make it so normal people never have to see it, but Nix is a programming language and that can't change. | 03:36:59 |
| David Arnold (blaggacao) | I sense, the draw by number analogy has some innovation potential for us. | 03:37:04 |
| davidak | i think we don't need a nixos fork for that. it can fit into nixpkgs | 03:37:12 |
