 | NixOS Marketing | 269 Members |
| NixOS website + marketing team: https://nixos.org/community/teams/marketing.html | 58 Servers |
| NixOS Marketing | 269 Members |
| NixOS website + marketing team: https://nixos.org/community/teams/marketing.html | 58 Servers |
| Sender | Message | Time |
|---|---|---|
| 25 Nov 2022 | ||
 @rapenne-s:tchncs.de | I don't think installing nix itself is an issue for getting more popular, and stuff like https://github.com/DeterminateSystems/harmonic/ make it even easier to install it <3 | 17:45:10 |
 matthewcroughan - nix.zone | So the way to make that pure is LD_PRELOAD, and it's possible we could outright fix it, but not enough effort has went into that. | 17:45:19 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.zone | In reply to @rapenne-s:tchncs.deI mean, I can give you an 18M file, and you can have your own Nix. | 17:45:45 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.zone | Nix statically links. | 17:45:52 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.zone | nix build github:nixos/nix#nix-static | 17:46:20 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.zone | | 17:46:58 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.zone | Okay 19M, it's bloating up a bit, lol. | 17:47:07 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.zone | But I've done this for RISC-V and ran Nix on Fedora on a RISC-V machine, as part of bootstrapping https://github.com/MatthewCroughan/visionfive-nix | 17:47:35 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.zone | if I give that 19M file, chmod +x ./nix and then ./nix shell github:matthewcroughan/nixcfg#whereverMyVimIs I will get my Vim, anywhere. | 17:48:20 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.zone | I can do that on Android if I compile it for arm64 like nix build github:nixos/nix#packages.aarch64-linux.nix-static | 17:48:45 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.zone | I'll then get a slightly smaller binary thanks to arm64 instructions being better, and then I'll be able to run that on Android like I do in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OV2hi8b5t48 | 17:49:20 |
| @rapenne-s:tchncs.de | that's far stretched away from the general use case | 17:49:41 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.zone | Sure, I just mean that "installation" may not be very important with a static Nix. | 17:51:25 |
| 26 Nov 2022 | ||
 davidak | In reply to @matthewcroughan:defenestrate.itSolène Rapenne (she/her): DistroTube categorizes Arch and Gentoo as MEME distros. we shouldn't be known because of a MEME. we have to work out why people would use our distro, instead of "to be cool, edgy, whatever" https://youtu.be/Bhj3iNirUlc?t=353 (you can disagree with him. e.g. i'm very angry about his take on user-friendly distros) | 09:21:45 |
| davidak | there are MEMEs about NixOS, but their topic is why not to use it | 09:22:02 |
| davidak |  Download 6e43d444c6c64a70.png | 09:22:15 |
| davidak |  Download fef4e7f73fbca41179060500174f1448d16fb8c9.jpeg | 09:22:34 |
 riotbib | There's also the opposite, but mostly fun about / with(?) Eelco. https://github.com/gytis-ivaskevicius/high-quality-nix-content/tree/master/memes | 09:24:32 |
| davidak | In reply to @rapenne-s:tchncs.de
| 09:33:22 |
| davidak | most of these topics is UX, not marketing. but we don't have an UX team, which is the whole reason these issues exist in the first place. if we had someone and later a team for UX, we would have nix ui figured out before any code was written. but because it started as an academic project, UX was never relevant (enough to let a professional work on it), and now we struggle in the market of linux distros. we have to take this criticism and memes very seriously. they tell us very directly where we fail. why are they talking about file system structure with hashes? because that's the first thing we tell them in documentation! https://nixos.org/manual/nix/stable/#introduction why does an end-user need to know such technical detail? they don't! why do we tell it anyway? because we are horrible at presentation, marketing and UX (or the focus is on developers and we ignore end-users completely) that's something we have to figure out as a project. in short, we are a group of "utterly deranged functional programmers" that create software and wonder than why not everyone is amazed by their wizardry. we might impress haskell developers, but users need an operating system that just works and they can get work done. we have a potential of providing value for them, but now it's still a projects for linux nerds that like to spend a lot of time with fixing issues why do i make such rants over and over again? because i believe in the potential the project has, like everyone here i guess, but i see the project is not capable to use it, because whole teams are missing, like UX designers, a QA team, maybe a more user centered support (could be done by community, with some training), and we need marketing professionals in the marketing team..... i guess it would be more constructive to think a bit more about the issue and create a vision for the project to become a great solution for desktop users, post it to the forum and share it with the foundation board, that could help with organizing teams etc and move the project in a direction where it can be successful in this regard. sorry if my posts where distracting here | 10:05:22 |
| davidak | * CW: rant most of these topics is UX, not marketing. but we don't have an UX team, which is the whole reason these issues exist in the first place. if we had someone and later a team for UX, we would have nix ui figured out before any code was written. but because it started as an academic project, UX was never relevant (enough to let a professional work on it), and now we struggle in the market of linux distros. we have to take this criticism and memes very seriously. they tell us very directly where we fail. why are they talking about file system structure with hashes? because that's the first thing we tell them in documentation! https://nixos.org/manual/nix/stable/#introduction why does an end-user need to know such technical detail? they don't! why do we tell it anyway? because we are horrible at presentation, marketing and UX (or the focus is on developers and we ignore end-users completely) that's something we have to figure out as a project. in short, we are a group of "utterly deranged functional programmers" that create software and wonder than why not everyone is amazed by their wizardry. we might impress haskell developers, but users need an operating system that just works and they can get work done. we have a potential of providing value for them, but now it's still a projects for linux nerds that like to spend a lot of time with fixing issues why do i make such rants over and over again? because i believe in the potential the project has, like everyone here i guess, but i see the project is not capable to use it, because whole teams are missing, like UX designers, a QA team, maybe a more user centered support (could be done by community, with some training), and we need marketing professionals in the marketing team..... i guess it would be more constructive to think a bit more about the issue and create a vision for the project to become a great solution for desktop users, post it to the forum and share it with the foundation board, that could help with organizing teams etc and move the project in a direction where it can be successful in this regard. sorry if my posts where distracting here | 10:06:05 |
| davidak | marketing team: have you created a summary of feedback people give publicly on nixos? like i did here for one video https://discourse.nixos.org/t/marketing-team-can-we-present-nix-nixos-better/6249/56?u=davidak i think we have to do that and work towards not getting bad feedback. like the existential question "why is this project needed"? many people think it's not needed, as you can see on HackerNews etc. if we just focus on the user survey, we might become even more niche, because we focus on the niche audience we could convince in the past | 10:19:08 |
 afontain | I think you are making very important points davidak. | 11:42:50 |
| davidak | i'm thinking about this perspective for a long time, but i don't know how to go forward from the idea stage. i can't do all myself and others seem not to care that much about the perspective. otherwise we wouldn't be at this point | 11:49:03 |
 @/yvan:matrix.org joined the room. | 18:09:46 | |
| matthewcroughan - nix.zone | In reply to @davidak:matrix.orgPiKVM is a real product that's based on Arch. The hot takes of people like DistroTube don't really effect what people create. | 18:35:36 |
| matthewcroughan - nix.zone | Steam Deck, PiKVM, two products I think would work much better on NixOS than Arch, but alas. I haven't had the time to fully Nixify PiKVM, but have spent a bit of time on a few components of there's which you can see PRs for on their GH | 18:36:58 |
| 27 Nov 2022 | ||
| davidak | matthewcroughan - nix.how: what youtubers say affect users, because popular people seem knowlegeable. you could call them thought leaders. if they say flatpaks are the future of desktop apps, users will consider that perspective when no popular person talks about nixos, no one will consider it and it's missing in the public discussion, even if it might be superior to arch or debian | 19:18:47 |
| davidak | * matthewcroughan - nix.how: what youtubers say affect users, because popular people seem knowlegeable. you could call them thought leaders. if they say flatpaks are the future of desktop apps, users will consider that perspective. when no popular person talks about nixos, no one will consider it and it's missing in the public discussion, even if it might be superior to arch or debian | 19:31:43 |
| davidak | * matthewcroughan - nix.how: what youtubers say affect users, because popular people seem knowlegeable. you could call them thought leaders. if they say flatpaks are the future of desktop apps, users will consider that perspective. when no popular person talks about nixos, no one will consider it and it's missing in the public discussion, even if it might be superior to arch or debian | 19:32:00 |