| 7 Jun 2021 |
 siraben | sterni (he/him): do builds take a while for you as well on darwin? | 10:26:28 |
| siraben | I guess we run older machines but on linux it feels a lot faster | 10:26:36 |
|  vaibhavsagar joined the room. | 10:28:58 |
 sterni (he/him) | never compared on the same machine | 10:37:22 |
| sterni (he/him) | but darwin GHC takes for ever | 10:37:26 |
 pwmosquito | sterni (he/him) maralorn at our company quite a few people already work on M1s and over time more will follow. If it's helpful for you I think I can arrange a dedicated M1 mac mini for you to build on. What do you think? | 11:51:00 |
 maralorn | pwmosquito: I’m sorry, but I don‘t have enough spare time to maintain platforms I don‘t use. | 11:54:48 |
| pwmosquito | Ideally i want to get us more involved in helping to maintain the darwin bits as we do rely on it (also already donating to Domen's OSX initiative) but that'll take longer to do so i thought if it's at all helpful i can at least organise some hardware in case anyone needs it to compile on | 11:57:48 |
| maralorn | In reply to @pwmosquito:matrix.org
Ideally i want to get us more involved in helping to maintain the darwin bits as we do rely on it (also already donating to Domen's OSX initiative) but that'll take longer to do so i thought if it's at all helpful i can at least organise some hardware in case anyone needs it to compile on Thank, you. That's certainly appreciated. | 11:59:29 |
| maralorn | Just need someone who is motivated to do this. | 12:00:13 |
| pwmosquito | 100% | 12:06:35 |
| sterni (he/him) | I think we should definitely talk to Domen Kožar on this, as far as I am aware they have a stake in all three things concerned: Haskell, macOS and aarch64-darwin specifically | 12:12:17 |
| maralorn | Well, I mean we are not even sure that it’s a huge amount of work, right? I mean theoretically it could just build, right? | 12:13:58 |
| sterni (he/him) | I mean there are bound to be unexpected problems, like me having to spend an entire morning packaging apple's xattr “fork” and stuff like that | 12:20:22 |
| sterni (he/him) | also darwin is not in a perfect state by any means as evidenced by tests.writers and GHC outside of stdenv being broken | 12:20:57 |
| sterni (he/him) | I am getting increasingly frustrated by the situation since I personally have little stake in darwin and am not really well equip to do stuff for darwin as the darwin machine I have is 10 years old now | 12:22:00 |
| sterni (he/him) | but it is not like I can stop caring since if darwin GHC / haskellPackages breaks, the nixpkgs channel stops advancing | 12:22:46 |
 cdepillabout | I don't think it would be crazy to stop maintaining it if none of us want to use it. We'd have to remove it from blocking the nixpkgs channel though. | 12:25:16 |
| cdepillabout | I mean, ideally what we should do is come up with a list of packages we'd like help maintaining, and create an announcement asking for help. I'm imagining mainly darwin and aarch64 stuff. | 12:26:11 |
| sterni (he/him) | cdepillabout: no we can't realistically say that cachix will stop working in the channel | 12:26:23 |
| cdepillabout | We can totally say that cachix will stop working in the channel if no one is willing to maintain it. | 12:26:51 |
| sterni (he/him) | I guess we have to | 12:27:13 |
| sterni (he/him) | but given the current situation and the experience from the last two days, I am pretty sceptical that it is a good idea to add aarch64-darwin support at all if no one says they will maintain it | 12:27:58 |
| sterni (he/him) | because I don't want to get forced into a situation were I have to keep it working | 12:28:12 |
| sterni (he/him) | what is the platform support tier of aarch64-darwin now anyways? | 12:28:35 |
| maralorn | sterni (he/him): peti never even checked if anything was building on aarch64 or darwin. He didn‘t even notice. | 12:28:47 |
| cdepillabout | In reply to @sternenseemann:systemli.org
but given the current situation and the experience from the last two days, I am pretty sceptical that it is a good idea to add aarch64-darwin support at all if no one says they will maintain it Yeah, that is completely understandable. | 12:28:56 |
| maralorn | I think us ignoring this and saying that people who care need to care is totally okay. | 12:29:29 |
| sterni (he/him) | maralorn: I mean I don't want to go back to that attitude, but I can definitely relate more to that nowadays | 12:29:37 |
| maralorn | I mean we shouldn‘t actively break stuff and if something is easy to fix we can do it. | 12:30:05 |
